Windows 10 App Essentials: resolving a long-standing speech issue


Amir
 

Hi Joseph and all,

Over the past year or so I've had a relatively pesky issue with Windows 10 App Essentials. When the add-on is enabled, NVDA tends to auto-read certain elements on the screen randomly. For instance, when I'm positioned in, say, Notepad, I might hear the word, "Desktop". Or when I'm pressing the Down Arrow in the list of tweets in, say, Chicken Nugget, NVDA might auto-read the contents of a tweet located several items above the one which has the focus. This issue, while rather sporadic, does indeed affect NVDA's usability.
Joseph, more than a year ago you and I tried to pinpoint the root cause of this glitch on Twitter -- to no avail. So I'm wondering if others happen to encounter this issue with Windows 10 App Essentials.
I'm currently running Win 10 Pro 64-Bit 21H1, and have been running all alpha builds of Win 10 App Essentials over the past couple of years. I also use the following NVDA settings in the Object Presentation window:
Report tooltips check box not checked,
Report notifications check box checked,
Report object shortcut keys check box not checked,
Report object position information check box checked,
Guess object position information when unavailable check box not checked,
Report object descriptions check box checked,
Report dynamic content changes check box checked.

Best,
Amir


Alberto Buffolino
 

Amir, il 08/06/2021 14.11, ha scritto:
also use the following NVDA settings in the Object Presentation window:
Report tooltips check box not checked,
Report notifications check box checked,
Report object shortcut keys check box not checked,
Report object position information check box checked,
Guess object position information when unavailable check box not checked,
Report object descriptions check box checked,
Report dynamic content changes check box checked.
Alberto:
Hi Amir,
have you tried to disable mouse tracking?
Alberto


Florian Beijers
 

Hi Amir,

This may be a stupid question and you may have already checked this,
but what you are describing sounds an awful lot like something or
other is making your mouse move around and NVDA reading the mouse
position. You can test this by turning off mouse reading entirely, or
turning off the mouse in device manager to see if that fixes it?

Florian


2021-06-08 14:11 GMT+02:00, Amir <mobilespace08@gmail.com>:

Hi Joseph and all,

Over the past year or so I've had a relatively pesky issue with Windows 10
App Essentials. When the add-on is enabled, NVDA tends to auto-read certain
elements on the screen randomly. For instance, when I'm positioned in, say,
Notepad, I might hear the word, "Desktop". Or when I'm pressing the Down
Arrow in the list of tweets in, say, Chicken Nugget, NVDA might auto-read
the contents of a tweet located several items above the one which has the
focus. This issue, while rather sporadic, does indeed affect NVDA's
usability.
Joseph, more than a year ago you and I tried to pinpoint the root cause of
this glitch on Twitter -- to no avail. So I'm wondering if others happen to
encounter this issue with Windows 10 App Essentials.
I'm currently running Win 10 Pro 64-Bit 21H1, and have been running all
alpha builds of Win 10 App Essentials over the past couple of years. I also
use the following NVDA settings in the Object Presentation window:
Report tooltips check box not checked,
Report notifications check box checked,
Report object shortcut keys check box not checked,
Report object position information check box checked,
Guess object position information when unavailable check box not checked,
Report object descriptions check box checked,
Report dynamic content changes check box checked.

Best,
Amir






Amir
 

Hi Florian and Alberto,

I just disabled NVDA's Mouse-tracking (disabling it in the Device Manager doesn't sound like a good idea). However, I'm wondering why NVDA's Mouse-tracking feature should generate this glitch. In my case at least, disabling the Win 10 App Essentials add-on has taken care of the issue, but let's see what disabling Mouse-tracking might bring to the table. BTW I've also seen it at least on two more Win 10 machines.

Best,
Amir


Florian Beijers
 

Generally this happens to me when my palm accidentally brushes the touchpad and the palm detection fails, or when there is a hardware defect that is making the mouse sort of dance around on its own. There was a laptop where I disabled the mouse entirely for that reason given it was unusable anyway and I could always plug in a USB mouse  for the once-a-year time I needed it.


Op di 8 jun. 2021 om 15:35 schreef Amir <mobilespace08@...>:

Hi Florian and Alberto,

I just disabled NVDA's Mouse-tracking (disabling it in the Device Manager doesn't sound like a good idea). However, I'm wondering why NVDA's Mouse-tracking feature should generate this glitch. In my case at least, disabling the Win 10 App Essentials add-on has taken care of the issue, but let's see what disabling Mouse-tracking might bring to the table. BTW I've also seen it at least on two more Win 10 machines.

Best,
Amir


Amir
 

Hmm -- interesting. I'm using a wireless keyboard with my laptop so the palmrest area can't be touched in any way. However, after disabling NVDA's Mouse-tracking it hasn't happened to me. So if the issue lies within NVDA, it should be fixed by the devs. I haven't seen such a thing with JAWS.

Best,
Amir


Andre Fisher
 

Hi.

To be fair, JAWS does not track the mouse by default like NVDA does.


Cyrille
 

Hello

Sometimes, I face this issue when my mouse is not completely flat on the desk but almost.
I imagine that the mouse may detect little vibrations that make it measure very little movements.
Putting again the mouse correctly flat on the desk solves the issue.

Cheers,

Cyrille

 
De : "Amir"
A : nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io
Envoyé: mardi 8 Juin 2021 15:35
Objet : Re: [nvda-addons] Windows 10 App Essentials: resolving a long-standing speech issue
 
Hi Florian and Alberto,

I just disabled NVDA's Mouse-tracking (disabling it in the Device Manager doesn't sound like a good idea). However, I'm wondering why NVDA's Mouse-tracking feature should generate this glitch. In my case at least, disabling the Win 10 App Essentials add-on has taken care of the issue, but let's see what disabling Mouse-tracking might bring to the table. BTW I've also seen it at least on two more Win 10 machines.

Best,
Amir


 

Hi,

I think I remember our Twitter conversation a while ago. At least to verify that this has to do with the add-on and/or mouse tracking code, I need a debug log fragment with WinTenApps enabled and:

  • Mouse tracking off
  • Mouse tracking on

 

You can either send the log directly to me (because debug logs can include private information), or if you can pinpoint to specific speech or incident such as Notepad/desktop announcement, just post that fragment here.

Cheers,

Joseph

From: nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io <nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io> On Behalf Of Cyrille via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, June 8, 2021 8:22 AM
To: nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io
Subject: Re: [nvda-addons] Windows 10 App Essentials: resolving a long-standing speech issue

 

Hello

Sometimes, I face this issue when my mouse is not completely flat on the desk but almost.
I imagine that the mouse may detect little vibrations that make it measure very little movements.
Putting again the mouse correctly flat on the desk solves the issue.

Cheers,

Cyrille

 

De : "Amir"
A : nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io
Envoyé: mardi 8 Juin 2021 15:35
Objet : Re: [nvda-addons] Windows 10 App Essentials: resolving a long-standing speech issue
 

Hi Florian and Alberto,

I just disabled NVDA's Mouse-tracking (disabling it in the Device Manager doesn't sound like a good idea). However, I'm wondering why NVDA's Mouse-tracking feature should generate this glitch. In my case at least, disabling the Win 10 App Essentials add-on has taken care of the issue, but let's see what disabling Mouse-tracking might bring to the table. BTW I've also seen it at least on two more Win 10 machines.

Best,
Amir


Brian's Mail list account
 

Also what happens if you turn off dynamic update as well.

I haven noticed at some times this stops loads of stuff that nvda might think has changed but has not. The snag of course is that then you never know if something actually has changed.
Brian

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----- Original Message -----
From: "Alberto Buffolino" <a.buffolino@gmail.com>
To: <nvda-addons@nvda-addons.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, June 08, 2021 1:24 PM
Subject: Re: [nvda-addons] Windows 10 App Essentials: resolving a long-standing speech issue


Amir, il 08/06/2021 14.11, ha scritto:
also use the following NVDA settings in the Object Presentation window:
Report tooltips check box not checked,
Report notifications check box checked,
Report object shortcut keys check box not checked,
Report object position information check box checked,
Guess object position information when unavailable check box not checked,
Report object descriptions check box checked,
Report dynamic content changes check box checked.
Alberto:
Hi Amir,
have you tried to disable mouse tracking?
Alberto




Amir
 

Hi Joseph,

Thanks for your attention.
So far disabling NVDA's Mouse-tracking has taken care of it. Give me a couple more days to see if it returns.

Best,
Amir